[davii]

My ex girlfriend and her Wiccan reletives believe I'm her angel. Not in the sense of wings 'n' white light, but someone she was supposed to meet and learn a lesson from.

Why that comes under the heading of angel by them, I'm not entirely sure, so make of that what you will :-?

[Anne57]

Originally Posted by zordavee

Two things. First, why would a guardian angel help someone to catch a bus or help save someone from a fire! If angels can do such things, why are hundreds of people killed on the roads, by suicide bombers, by silly accidents, day after day? Are a privileged few given an angel? and if so why?
Secondly, Doris Stokes was on television years ago, and someone asked her if we all had guardian angels. She replied everyone had one looking out for them and protecting them. On that same evening there was an item on the news about a man who had lured several women, most but not all prostitutes, into the basement of his house in New York and kept them there for several months, raping and beating them. Now, first, where were their guardian angels who could have warned them in the first place? and in the WHOLE of New York, was there not one psychic person who could sense this awful treatment of these women and warn the authorities?
To carry it further, why was there not a great angelic/psychic shout of warning before the tsunami hit the Pacific. There was hours of warning possible, yet we have heard of no credible (or otherwise) prediction of the event.

As an aside, please can the angels of spelling, punctuation and grammar please bless this forum

Hi Zordavee,
I have often thought the same as you, when we hear of tragedies such as the Tsunami or 9/11. However, I think we all tend to miss the point a bit on what 'living' is all about. We all expect everything to be alright and nothing bad to happen, and we kind of expect 'Angels' or even 'God' or whoever to step in and prevent bad things happening. Its only my personal opinion but I think we all have to experience things, good and bad, thats what its all about, and sometimes people survive the bad things and will think they have been protected, maybe they have, maybe because it wasn't their time to move on or maybe they were just lucky.w

Not sure about the Tsunami, but with 9/11 I have heard plenty of stories in the media about people who had premonitions, other people who didn't have premonitions but suddenly changed their travel plans at the last minute for whatever reason which kept them out of danger, I have a relative who did just this and it wasn't because of a premonition, just a collective decision by a group of colleagues. I am sure there are similar stories with the Tsunami. Another relative tried to book in one of the resorts in Thailand that got devastated in the Tsunami, he had stayed there before and enjoyed it, unfortunately he was late booking and couldn't get in, so went somewhere else. Was someone looking after him, or was it just luck? Whatver the reason I don't think the people who weren't so luck, were not being looked after, maybe they were still being 'looked after' just in a different way.

Its worth thinking about.

[astrologer50]

Originally Posted by Anne57

Hi Zordavee,
I have often thought the same as you, when we hear of tragedies such as the Tsunami or 9/11. However, I think we all tend to miss the point a bit on what 'living' is all about. We all expect everything to be alright and nothing bad to happen, and we kind of expect 'Angels' or even 'God' or whoever to step in and prevent bad things happening. Its only my personal opinion but I think we all have to experience things, good and bad, thats what its all about, and sometimes people survive the bad things and will think they have been protected, maybe they have, maybe because it wasn't their time to move on or maybe they were just lucky.w

Not sure about the Tsunami, but with 9/11 I have heard plenty of stories in the media about people who had premonitions, other people who didn't have premonitions but suddenly changed their travel plans at the last minute for whatever reason which kept them out of danger, I have a relative who did just this and it wasn't because of a premonition, just a collective decision by a group of colleagues. I am sure there are similar stories with the Tsunami. Another relative tried to book in one of the resorts in Thailand that got devastated in the Tsunami, he had stayed there before and enjoyed it, unfortunately he was late booking and couldn't get in, so went somewhere else. Was someone looking after him, or was it just luck? Whatver the reason I don't think the people who weren't so luck, were not being looked after, maybe they were still being 'looked after' just in a different way.

Its worth thinking about.

Well said and written
I too believe there are two kinds of Angels, one in the body offering daily assistance, help, assurance and guidance. The second are the true angelic realms. I do believe these being although not from human life experience, prob more ET can and do lower their vibrational energy to offering healing, advice, counsel and inspiration to us in 3D BUT you must remember why we are ALL hear primarily is to LEARN certain things, LESSONS with certain people at certain times, cos thats how we all Grow isn't it??

Angels, guides, doorkeepers and spirit relatives are all around us, supporting helping and guiding us with our life Lessons, BUT are not allowed to intervene with our Free Will as this is paramount and vital, or else we would be all walking around as zombies if people beleive in destiny and fate there would be no hope, nothing to look forward too.

If a natural or unatural accident would stop us from learning our Lessons I do beleive and trust that spirit, guides, helpers, relatives, God and Angels would step and pull us back from the brink. On the other hand 9/11 and Tsumani events, those souls, soul groups had probably chosen how the passed over before they were born. Its like asking why do children and babies die and why doesnt God save them, why are some born handicapped, mentally or phsyically? Because they have CHOSEN certain Lessons with certain people, families etc. Even our departing this world is tied in with relatives, partners, children and friends.

Best part is it doesnt really matter if we fail or succeed cos even if we fail the Lesson is usually repeated anyway. For example, i married my last husband twice and then divorced him twice, cos I wanted to finish the Lesson too soon, but my Spirit/Soul and the Universe had different ideas........you will go back and finish the Lesson. Why do some women go from one man that abuses and hits them to another...........because they didnt Learn the Lesson....

To see more spiritual post go to Astrology Forum LOL

[Anne57]

[
I too believe there are two kinds of Angels, one in the body offering daily assistance, help, assurance and guidance. The second are the true angelic realms. I do believe these being although not from human life experience, prob more ET can and do lower their vibrational energy to offering healing, advice, counsel and inspiration to us in 3D BUT you must remember why we are ALL hear primarily is to LEARN certain things, LESSONS with certain people at certain times, cos thats how we all Grow isn't it??

Angels, guides, doorkeepers and spirit relatives are all around us, supporting helping and guiding us with our life Lessons, BUT are not allowed to intervene with our Free Will as this is paramount and vital, or else we would be all walking around as zombies if people beleive in destiny and fate there would be no hope, nothing to look forward too.

If a natural or unatural accident would stop us from learning our Lessons I do beleive and trust that spirit, guides, helpers, relatives, God and Angels would step and pull us back from the brink. On the other hand 9/11 and Tsumani events, those souls, soul groups had probably chosen how the passed over before they were born. Its like asking why do children and babies die and why doesnt God save them, why are some born handicapped, mentally or phsyically? Because they have CHOSEN certain Lessons with certain people, families etc. Even our departing this world is tied in with relatives, partners, children and friends.

Best part is it doesnt really matter if we fail or succeed cos even if we fail the Lesson is usually repeated anyway. For example, i married my last husband twice and then divorced him twice, cos I wanted to finish the Lesson too soon, but my Spirit/Soul and the Universe had different ideas........you will go back and finish the Lesson. Why do some women go from one man that abuses and hits them to another...........because they didnt Learn the Lesson....


[/quote]

I do agree entirely with what you are saying Astrologer.

[aidan80]

It is my belief that angels and god can not disturb what is meant to happen, no matter how sick or twisted it is. You have to live and learn and what i can gather from reading books the harsh lessons are there to teach us, do we learn from these lessons?

[nephilum]

reincarnation

[lemonelemi]

Originally Posted by zordavee

Two things. First, why would a guardian angel help someone to catch a bus or help save someone from a fire! If angels can do such things, why are hundreds of people killed on the roads, by suicide bombers, by silly accidents, day after day? Are a privileged few given an angel? and if so why?

Angels only intervene when that person is not meant to die or be harmed. We all have free will, they don't. They only help us when we ask. They never interfere.

Originally Posted by zordavee

Secondly, Doris Stokes was on television years ago, and someone asked her if we all had guardian angels. She replied everyone had one looking out for them and protecting them. On that same evening there was an item on the news about a man who had lured several women, most but not all prostitutes, into the basement of his house in New York and kept them there for several months, raping and beating them. Now, first, where were their guardian angels who could have warned them in the first place? and in the WHOLE of New York, was there not one psychic person who could sense this awful treatment of these women and warn the authorities?

These women had chosen to die like this before they incarnated. There could be many reasons. Lessons to learn. Karmic debt. Lessons for others. Nothing can interfere with what is meant to be. Sometimes it takes a terrible disaster with hundreds of deaths for one simple change to take place that will ultimately save thousands of lives in the future.

Originally Posted by zordavee

To carry it further, why was there not a great angelic/psychic shout of warning before the tsunami hit the Pacific. There was hours of warning possible, yet we have heard of no credible (or otherwise) prediction of the event.

Because this is just the way it is, and we all have to die, and this is just how these people chose to go back home. Sometimes, we go home before our time but this is usually via suicide rather than accident. Think of all the incredible narrow escapes that occurred in the Tsunami. Why? Because it was simply not these people's time to die, and their angels will have engineered their survival. They can only do this if the person is not meant to die or come to harm at that time.

[lemonelemi]

Originally Posted by zordavee

To carry it further, why was there not a great angelic/psychic shout of warning before the tsunami hit the Pacific. There was hours of warning possible, yet we have heard of no credible (or otherwise) prediction of the event.

Another interesting fact regarding the Tsunami is that the animals did indeed pick up on what was about to happen, and heeded the signs. That humans have mostly lost the ability to tune in and 'listen' is our own fault. We are so concerned with our 'material' world that we have lost the ability to do this. We don't listen. Like the majority of us humans don't listen to our angels or guides. If we did, then the world would be a much better place. If we don't listen to the advice or warnings given us by our guides and angels, then we only have ourselves to blame (edited by mod - foul language)

[Gisela]

When people talk about Angels, I haven't a clue what they might mean. When I was a girl, I didn't have this problem. Angels were special entities that could move between Heaven and Earth and could help or hinder mankind in its spiritual endeavour.

There were other special responsibilities of angels. Once you were incarnated, you had your own personal guardian, not designed to look both ways so you could step out into the road, but to prompt your conscience when you were about to so something spiritually unhelpful, to you or anyone else. Guardian angels were not assigned to protect you physically, you were supposed to be able to do that yourself. The greek tranlations has them a 'messengers' of God and the Hebrew, the 'shadow side' (or earth side) of God.

The concept came to us from Jewish mythology, and the most famous Uriel, Michael Raphael and Gabriel rule the four parts of Earth N, S, E & W and the astrological elements Earth Fire Air Water and seasons Winter Summer Spring Autumn. The Jews seem to have learned the idea from the Babylonians, as angels appear in Zoroastrianism from 500 BCE.

There is no historical reference to them as wholly beneficial. They had agenda that worked for good or ill, depending on who they were. The common view of them with wings, if they have not shape shifted into human form, seems to be based on the celtic 'shining ones,' 15 ft or 24 ft tall entities, who appear to certain people and looked like they were made of light, with a human like form but floated or moved as though transported on light that gave an impression of flowing gowns and wings.

I assume some of the current crop, were invented along with the Barbie doll, but who was it that brought this strange modern concept to us and are there any of the old angels left. I remember with fondness the ones that appeared in mediaeval paintings and like to think that Ludus Puerorum (the children's game) was those first four angels singing the Universe we live in into existence.

[Mrs.Blowers]

Yes they do... that is like asking if the ocean has salt in it..
An angel took the form of a man and walked with me for years while i had cancer as a young girl. today he is my dad ( not my father) but the angel is no longer with him.